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Author Topic: 80 Acres of Hell
Petey
Whining Little Bitch
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I can appreciate the southern redneck culture

I'm thinking that makes me a redneck connoisseur...or a aficionado...

--------------------
I am a low life liberal scum bag

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Seventh Fleet
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quote:
It is the War Between the States which was the first great turning point in American history away from the system of government and the individual freedom that our Founders provided for us
Pud thanks for posting that great article, which so eloquently brought out the real reasons behind the war. Even though it flys in the face of current politically correct thinking. In that it doesn't support the mainstream thinking that Lincoln was a great POTUS. I was taught to believe that in the pantheon of presidents that the truly great ones were Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln. But after majoring in history and studying the war, I learned that this was most certainly not the case. In fact Lincoln was one of the very worst presidents this country has ever had in office and he did more than any of the others to undermine the constitution and bill of rights.


7th

--------------------
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SatCong
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RB,
You "piss on the graves of these rebel bastards"?
Fuck you and burn in hell you pig faced asshole. I piss down your throat if you weren't so inclined to bite the dick that creams your face. You have really let your mouth run off with your ass this time and it had to make several trips. You ignorant fuck!
SatCong

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Pud
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Question: What Was the Real Reason for the Civil War?





Answer: States' Rights! - NOT Slavery

Walter Williams



Jewish World Review, December 2, 1998

THE PROBLEMS THAT LED TO THE CIVIL WAR are the same problems today ----big, intrusive government. The reason we don't face the specter of another Civil War is because today's Americans don't have yesteryear's spirit of liberty and constitutional respect, and political statesmanship is in short supply.

Actually, the war of 1861 was not a civil war. A civil war is a conflict between two or more factions trying to take over a government. In 1861, Confederate President Jefferson Davis was no more interested in taking over Washington than George Washington was interested in taking over England in 1776. Like Washington, Davis was seeking independence. Therefore, the war of 1861 should be called "The War Between the States" or the "War for Southern Independence." The more bitter southerner might call it the "War of Northern Aggression."

History books have misled today's Americans to believe the war was fought to free slaves.

Statements from the time suggest otherwise. In President Lincoln's first inaugural address, he said, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the states where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so."

During the war, in an 1862 letter to the New York Daily Tribune editor Horace Greeley, Lincoln said, "My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and it is not either to save or destroy slavery." A recent article by Baltimore's Loyola College Professor Thomas DiLorenzo titled "The Great Centralizer," in The Independent Review (Fall 1998), cites quotation after quotation of similar northern sentiment about slavery.

Lincoln's intentions, as well as that of many northern politicians, were summarized by Stephen Douglas during the presidential debates. Douglas accused Lincoln of wanting to "impose on the nation a uniformity of local laws and institutions and a moral homogeneity dictated by the central government" that "place at defiance the intentions of the republic's founders." Douglas was right, and Lincoln's vision for our nation has now been accomplished beyond anything he could have possibly dreamed.

A precursor for a War Between the States came in 1832, when South Carolina called a convention to nullify tariff acts of 1828 and 1832, referred to as the "Tariffs of Abominations." A compromise lowering the tariff was reached, averting secession and possibly war. The North favored protective tariffs for their manufacturing industry. The South, which exported agricultural products to and imported manufactured goods from Europe, favored free trade and was hurt by the tariffs. Plus, a northern-dominated Congress enacted laws similar to Britain's Navigation Acts to protect northern shipping interests.

Shortly after Lincoln's election, Congress passed the highly protectionist Morrill tariffs.

That's when the South seceded, setting up a new government. Their constitution was nearly identical to the US. Constitution except that it outlawed protectionist tariffs, business handouts and mandated a two-thirds majority vote for all spending measures.

The only good coming from the War Between the States was the abolition of slavery. The great principle enunciated in the Declaration of Independence that "Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed" was overturned by force of arms. By destroying the states' right to secession, Abraham Lincoln opened the door to the kind of unconstrained, despotic, arrogant government we have today, something the framers of the Constitution could not have possibly imagined.

States should again challenge Washington's unconstitutional acts through nullification. But you tell me where we can find leaders with the love, courage and respect for our Constitution like Thomas Jefferson, James Madison and John C. Calhoun.

Walter E. Williams is an economics professor at George Mason University in Fairfax, Va. His column appears Sundays in the Daily News.

© 1996-1997 Sons of Confederate Veterans, 33rd Reg. NCST, Co. F, Camp 1695

Posts: 6748 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
Retired Bum
Dirty Old Man
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SatCong,

Looks like I hurt yer widdle feelings. Too fuckin' bad. Anybody with the name "Cong" as part of their nic has got to be a fucker loser, just like the rebels.

Now don't take this personal, but you should hook up with Hanoi Jane Fonda. The two of ya could swap war stories. She could tell about visiting the POW's in the Hanoi Hilton and snitching some of them out when one of them handed her a note. You could regale her with yer exploits about being a Keyboard Kommando and being awarded Retired Bum's Asshole of the Year Medal 1st Klass.

Have a nice day and all that shit. Or have a bad day and eat shit and die. Which ever floats yer boat.....


The Retired One

Posts: 12920 | From: Hoosier State | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
pato
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Jeez,
Just as I was beginning to like RB, I find out he's a Yank.

Shame.

pato

--------------------
En la vida se presentan dos o tres ocasiones para ser heroe, pero casi todos los dias se presentan la ocasion para no ser cobarde"

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Teufelhund
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Walter Williams is one of my favorite real deal conservatives. He also wrote the introduction for a book titled "The Real Lincoln" which is excellent.

The "Real Lincoln" works as a great study guide to sift though the rest of the revisionist bullshit. The intresting thing, is that the truth is right before our eyes. So many folks have thier head up thier asses concerning our form of government (Constitutional Republic) that they don't seee Lincoln as the criminal he was.

Sad state of affairs that won't be fixed by voting. Voting just dosen't make a fuck when you have folks that believe current Republicans are "conservative".

Until something realy dramatic happens it's going to be the same ole' same ole'.

Teuf,

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Retired Bum
Dirty Old Man
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pato,

I'm heartbroken that you feel that way about me. Just all torn up inside. I'm gonna have to get in touch with my inner feelings and see where I have gone wrong. Then I will have to consider what I should do to make things right.

Okay, enough of the sarcastic bullshit. Yeah, I'm a Yank. Born and raised in the North.

And so it goes......


The Retired One

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SatCong
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...and a prison guard too, GG Liddy has a lot to say about your ilk, (dickless) hermaphrodite.
SatCong

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Seventh Fleet
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You guys are being to harsh on the deranged old coot. If we piss him off bad enough, he won't come up with anymore of those great gun triva threads we all enjoy so much. [Frown]

Just because he's a yankee doesn't necessarily mean that he's got his head so far up his ass, that everything he hears has an echo. I have lots of friends from the North who have figured out for themselves, the real truth about the war. The fact the tyrant Lincoln started America down the road toward our present sorry state, which gave us our present huge, out of control, federal government, that we all love to bitch about, should be apparent to all.... All because the wrong side won the war. Should be apparent to those with even half a brain.

A little knowledge goes a long way toward dispelling myths, half truths and outright lies and if we keep posting the truth, then maybe the truth will begin to sink in for him as well. Or maybe not, because like they say, you can't teach an old dog new tricks and he's probably grown used to that echo by now. [Razz]

7th

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Pud
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DiLorenzo Is Right About Lincoln
by Walter E. Williams
by Walter E. Williams



In 1831, long before the War between the States, South Carolina Senator John C. Calhoun said, "Stripped of all its covering, the naked question is, whether ours is a federal or consolidated government; a constitutional or absolute one; a government resting solidly on the basis of the sovereignty of the States, or on the unrestrained will of a majority; a form of government, as in all other unlimited ones, in which injustice, violence, and force must ultimately prevail." The War between the States answered that question and produced the foundation for the kind of government we have today: consolidated and absolute, based on the unrestrained will of the majority, with force, threats, and intimidation being the order of the day.

Today’s federal government is considerably at odds with that envisioned by the framers of the Constitution. Thomas J. DiLorenzo gives an account of how this came about in The Real Lincoln: A New Look at Abraham Lincoln, His Agenda, and an Unnecessary War.

As DiLorenzo documents – contrary to conventional wisdom, books about Lincoln, and the lessons taught in schools and colleges – the War between the States was not fought to end slavery; Even if it were, a natural question arises: Why was a costly war fought to end it? African slavery existed in many parts of the Western world, but it did not take warfare to end it. Dozens of countries, including the territorial possessions of the British, French, Portuguese, and Spanish, ended slavery peacefully during the late eighteenth and nineteenth centuries. Countries such as Venezuela and Colombia experienced conflict because slave emancipation was simply a ruse for revolutionaries who were seeking state power and were not motivated by emancipation per se.

Abraham Lincoln’s direct statements indicated his support for slavery; He defended slave owners’ right to own their property, saying that "when they remind us of their constitutional rights [to own slaves], I acknowledge them, not grudgingly but fully and fairly; and I would give them any legislation for the claiming of their fugitives" (in indicating support for the Fugitive Slave Act of 1850).

Abraham Lincoln’s Emancipation Proclamation was little more than a political gimmick, and he admitted so in a letter to Treasury Secretary Salmon P. Chase: "The original proclamation has no...legal justification, except as a military measure." Secretary of State William Seward said, "We show our sympathy with slavery by emancipating slaves where we cannot reach them and holding them in bondage where we can set them free. " Seward was acknowledging the fact that the Emancipation Proclamation applied only to slaves in states in rebellion against the United States and not to slaves in states not in rebellion.

The true costs of the War between the States were not the 620,000 battlefield-related deaths, out of a national population of 30 million (were we to control for population growth, that would be equivalent to roughly 5 million battlefield deaths today). The true costs were a change in the character of our government into one feared by the likes of Jefferson, Madison, Monroe, Jackson, and Calhoun – one where states lost most of their sovereignty to the central government. Thomas Jefferson saw as the most important safeguard of the liberties of the people "the support of the state governments in all their rights, as the most competent administrations for our domestic concerns and the surest bulwarks against anti-republican tendencies."

If the federal government makes encroachments on the constitutional rights of the people and the states, what are their options? In a word, their right to secede. Most of today’s Americans believe, as did Abraham Lincoln, that states do not have a right to secession, but that is false. DiLorenzo marshals numerous proofs that from the very founding of our nation the right of secession was seen as a natural right of the people and a last check on abuse by the central government. For example, at Virginia’s ratification convention, the delegates affirmed "that the powers granted under the Constitution being derived from the People of the United States may be resumed by them whensoever the same shall be perverted to injury or oppression." In Thomas Jefferson’s First Inaugural Address (1801), he declared, "If there be any among us who would wish to dissolve this Union or to change its republican form, let them stand undisturbed as monuments of the safety with which error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it." Jefferson was defending the rights of free speech and of secession. Alexis de Tocqueville observed in Democracy in America, "The Union was formed by the voluntary agreement of the States; in uniting together they have not forfeited their nationality, nor have they been reduced to the condition of one and the same people. If one of the states chooses to withdraw from the compact, it would be difficult to disapprove its right of doing so, and the Federal Government would have no means of maintaining its claims directly either by force or right." The right to secession was popularly held as well. DiLorenzo lists newspaper after newspaper editorial arguing the right of secession. Most significantly, these were Northern newspapers. In fact, the first secession movement started in the North, long before shots were fired at Fort Sumter. The New England states debated the idea of secession during the Hartford Convention of 1814–1815.

Lincoln’s intentions, as well as those of many Northern politicians, were summarized by Stephen Douglas during the senatorial debates. Douglas accused Lincoln of wanting to "impose on the nation a uniformity of local laws and institutions and a moral homogeneity dictated by the central government" that would "place at defiance the intentions of the republic’s founders." Douglas was right, and Lincoln’s vision for our nation has now been accomplished beyond anything he could have possibly dreamed.

The War between the States settled by force whether states could secede. Once it was established that states cannot secede, the federal government, abetted by a Supreme Court unwilling to hold it to its constitutional restraints, was able to run amok over states’ rights, so much so that the protections of the Ninth and Tenth Amendments mean little or nothing today. Not only did the war lay the foundation for eventual nullification or weakening of basic constitutional protections against central government abuses, but it also laid to rest the great principle enunciated in the Declaration of Independence that "Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."

The Real Lincoln contains irrefutable evidence that a more appropriate title for Abraham Lincoln is not the Great Emancipator, but the Great Centralizer.

Foreword to The Real Lincoln: A New Look at Abraham Lincoln, His Agenda, and an Unnecessary War by Thomas J. DiLorenzo. Copyright © 2002 by Thomas J. DiLorenzo. Reprinted with permission.

March 22, 2005

Walter E. Williams is the John M. Olin distinguished professor of economics at George Mason University, and a nationally syndicated columnist.

Posts: 6748 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
Retired Bum
Dirty Old Man
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VietCong,

You should get yer head out of the cesspool and try and remember that G. Gordon Liddy was convicted of a federal felony and did about five years in a federal slammer. Remember Watergate? Remember Liddy's plan to kidnap some Democrat operatives and hold them until after the election?

Liddy is a bitter ex convict and during my 24 years as a corrections officer, I never heard any convict say anything good about us. Now that is some fuckin' surprise, isn't it?

If a dirtbag renegade ex FBI agent is your idea of a unimpeachable source of information, then you are even stupider than I thought.


The Retired One

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saltplainsgunman
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When I was stationed at Ft.Benning I had a good time and drove all over the South.I liked the people and was always treated good.Southern pussy is great stuff.

--------------------
FUCK OBAMA

Posts: 815 | From: By The Salt Fork | Registered: Sep 2003  |  IP: Logged
SatCong
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Retired Bum-fucker,
Whatever you say...
You continue to overload your pin head ass with your piledriver mouth and the rest of us will continue to snicker and nudge one another at the sight of you!
SatCong

Posts: 724 | From: Twangtown | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
saltplainsgunman
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Now this is what I like,the interesting,thought provoking exchange of ideas,the intellectual stimulation.

--------------------
FUCK OBAMA

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PATRIOT48071
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LOOK AT THE FACTS IN THE SOUTH IF YOU HAD A SLAVE IF HE GOT SICK YOU HAD TO FEED THEM TAKE CARE OF THEM AND HOUSE THEM. IF FOR ANY OTHER REASON BECOUSE YOU PAID A LOT OF MONEY FOR THEM. IN THE NORTH THEY HAD SLAVES TO BUT THEY WERE TREATED VARY BADLY. BUT YOU DONT HEAR ABOUT THEM BECOUSE THE WINNERS RIGHT THE HISTORY BOOKS. THEY WERE THE " IRISH AND THE ITALIAN " OR AS THE GOOD PEOPLE OF THE NORTH CALLED THEM ( MICKS AND WAPS ) AND IF THEY GET SICK WELL TO HELL WITH THEM JUST GET ANOTHER SORRY MICK OR WAP! HAY SO THERE FAMILY GO'S HUNGRY AND SICK AND THERE KIDS DIE WHO THE HELL CARES RIGHT. AND WE PACK THEM IN SLUMS LIKE GARBAGE AND WORK THEM 10 AND 12 HRS A DAY. 6 DAYS A WEEK IN THE FACTORIES AND THERE KIDS AS YOUNG AS 10 YEARS OLD WITH NO SAFTY STANDARDS WHAT SO EVER. AND IF ONE DIES NO PROBLEM YOU PAID NOTHING FOR THEM JUST GET ANOTHER ONE NO LOSS ON YOUR PART. THIS IS THE UGLY TRUTH. LINCOLN AND THE NORTH SET THE SLAVES FREE.....YEA RIGHT!
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Retired Bum
Dirty Old Man
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ShatCong,

What is the matter with you?

Running out of insults this early in the game?

About what I expect from a fuckin' feather merchant....


The Retired One

Posts: 12920 | From: Hoosier State | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
SatCong
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Retired Catheter Boy,
Why hijack the one thread, we can spill it over, I'm sure, cause your over-medicated ass thrives on it, oh ancient ward of the state.
SatCong

Posts: 724 | From: Twangtown | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Retired Bum
Dirty Old Man
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Just keep paying your federal taxes which helps pay my pension. In a couple of years I will be old enough to draw SS as well. It won't be much, but every dollar is welcome which is more than I can say for your sorry ass.


The Retired One

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SatCong
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What makes you think I pay taxes? Get out of that smallish box you call a mind. Your octegerian brain has stopped growing.
SatCong

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Pud
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[Big Grin] [Cool]
Posts: 6748 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
Hankster2
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Well i'm both glad and impressed so many here got it right!!! Kids and all today are so fucking brainwashed as to what the "civil war was all about.
RB....What the hell crawled up YOUR ass to make you both so bitter and BLIND to the truth and facts of the subject?????
If you believe the war WAS over slavery, why did Lincoln wait until it was half OVER before making the "emancipation proclamation"???
FACT> North was getting it's ass kicked, and the people were about fed up with war and the loses..he needed a
"rallying point" to stir up the folks and get support back. So he "used" the slaves for his own personal goals......nice guy.

And ....since we know the North was in it for "the money" (economics etc).....
And the South was fighting to defend thier homes.....WHO were the true "patriots" here?????

Lastly....We're in trouble today as a nation because the FEDS trample all over STATES rights....and have taken powers NOT granted them by the Constitution..the Gov is NOT kept "in check"..the very thing the South went to war over!!! Think of how different our lives might be.....had they WON!!

[ January 21, 2006, 10:06 PM: Message edited by: Hankster2 ]

--------------------
All thats necessary for Evil to triumph, is for Good men to do nothing.

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SatCong
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There are some interesting "alternative history" novels that are delightfully "whatiffy".
And upon contemplation, that "death of 600+K" might as easily be laid at the feet of the course oppression of Lincoln and his federally centralized government that had very little in
common with a states-rights oriented south and etcetera.
SatCong

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Pud
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This is for you Mr. SatCong you know your true history.

We are a band of brothers and native to the soil
Fighting for our Liberty, With treasure, blood and toil
And when our rights were threatened, the cry rose near and far
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star!
Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

As long as the Union was faithful to her trust
Like friends and brethren, kind were we, and just
But now, when Northern treachery attempts our rights to mar
We hoist on high the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand
Then came Alabama and took her by the hand
Next, quickly Mississippi, Georgia, and Florida
All raised on high the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Ye men of valor gather round the banner of the right
Texas and fair Louisiana join us in the fight
Davis, our loved President, and Stephens statesmen are
Now rally round the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

And here's to brave Virginia, the Old Dominion State.
With the young Confederacy at length has linked her fate.
Impelled by her example, now other States prepare
To hoist on high the Bonnie Blue flag that bears a single star.

Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Then here's to our Confederacy, strong we are and brave,
Like patriots of old we'll fight, our heritage to save.
And rather than submit to shame, to die we would prefer
So cheer for the Bonnie Blue flag that bears a single star.

Hurrah!
Hurrah!
For Southern rights, hurrah!
Hurrah for the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star.

Then cheer, boys, cheer, raise a joyous shout
For Arkansas and North Carolina now have both gone out;
And let another rousing cheer for Tennessee be given
The single star of the Bonnie Blue Flag has grown to be eleven!


"As long as the Union was faithful to her trust
Like friends and brethren, kind were we, and just
But now, when Northern treachery attempts our rights to mar
We hoist on high the Bonnie Blue Flag that bears a single star."

Sounds a little bit like the world we live in today.

Posts: 6748 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
Pud
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Mr. retired Bum worked too long for the Government just like me. I gave the bastards 37 years myself. LOL [Smile]
Posts: 6748 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
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